Deuces Wild Crash

[WJCJR1]

Today we had Boy Scout's Day at our airfield. It sure was an awesome day, lot of flying and buddy-box galore. I am certian a few new pilots were born today. I know for certain a couple parents said that's it I am in!

Now in regard to the title of this post I had an unfortunate accident this evening. Attached are a couple pictures of my baby. I was asked to do some hovering so I did. I was having a blast of a time doing some hovering at about 30' maybe even a little less so quite low. The Deuces Wild although NOT a 3D plane has so much power it can easily hover. Well I was doing this great fun hovering when disaster struck. The Deuces rocked back and forth a couple times and with my elevator on LOW rates I was unable to hold her from rolling back and she rolled back over on me and I was unable to gain enough airspeed to pull her out. I stuffed the Deuces Wild into the corn like nobody's business.

I did try very hard to pull her out but she just wouldn't get enough air under her wings and she went in. At first when she fell backwards on me from the hover I tried to just pull out but did not have enough airspeed and she began a direct straight plummet. I hit the throttle but she didn't seem to respond as I wanted so I dove for a fraction of a second and nailed the go pedal unfortunately it was all too little too late and she bit the corn and went in hard.

Fuselage is in very tough shape, both nacelles are trash, one LIPO is probably junk as it got smushed, both motors may be unrepairable as they are banged up real bad, Nose cone gone. I guess what's not broken is the tailfeathers, wing and hopefully all servos, RX and ESC's are good.

I am upset at myself. This was a foolish error to be hovering at such a low altitude with a heavy non-3D plane, wrong elevator settings for such stunts and just plainly not being respectful to the airplane and the aerodynamics.

So here's a couple pictures. The Deuces Wild is an awesome airplane and this crash had NOTHING to do with a malfunction, bad tendency or inability of the plane. Fully PILOT ERROR ::irked::

Wayne

http://www.horizonrcflyers.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=14&pictureid=771


http://www.horizonrcflyers.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=14&pictureid=772

[rcdude07]

Bummer dude. Not the first and not the last to bite the dust because someone else wanted to see something the plane was not purpose built for. Glad to hear the Scouts enjoyed the trip to the field.

[pinchflat]

Sad to see this plane banged up so soon. It was not in vain. Hopefully some of us will learn from your oops.

[WJCJR1]

I am extraordinarily busy with work, the fam., etc. so it may be a little while but I will get the Deuces back in the air.

I still have the E-Flite EXTRA 300 to build first then I'll be back into Deuces mode.

Wayne

[ATIS]

Wayne, sorry about the crash. I never make a plane do something it wasnt designed for...especially hovering. Hopefully you can get her back in the air without breaking the bank.

[liquid1]

Wayne, I just learned a good lesson..
1st listen to my Instructor
2nd Don't fly in to confined places.
I know your an experianced pilot and had a mis fortune and will have her back up soon.
I just busted up my Aprentice 15E broke the tail off all repaired Now cost me $12 buck and some ca and epoxy and packing tape. I hope my motor holds up its now a little noisey after me getting inverted and pile driving the nose into the ground. All is good and I enjoyed fixing the Damage..I was sick and pissed off at myself. After flying yesterday with Phantomphan my Instructor and him teaching me how to get better at my landing linups and the cool area we flew trough the trees to land. I'm back to having fun..:thumbsup:

[WJCJR1]

Biggest lessons to be had here:

Stay three mistakes high when performing maneuvers that are of high K factors.
Stay within your planes design ability.
Do not go outside your personal pilot skills unless you are 4 mistakes high ::very happy::
I broke all three of these rules and could have easily saved this accident from happening if I would have obeyed any single one of these rules.

In addition when I fell out of the hover I was trying to be fancy and come right back up for another hover. When she began rolling backwards on me I should have punched it and went straight north but instead I was planning on just looping down and out of it and coming right back into a hover. I had done this exact thing probably 10 times on this flight alone, no trouble at all. BUT this time when I was too low I did not have the altitude to gain that little bit more airspeed I needed and miscalculated and applied throttle WAY too late. Usually I am much higher when performing such hovers and when I looped down as I pulled up the loop being so small that created an immediate stall. Whenw\ I performed this same abort and re-engage from higher my abort loop was mcuh larger allowing for much higher airspeed thus NO chance for such an abrupt stall.

I am guessing the tassles of the corn grabbed the wings, props or even nose and pulled her in as I had plenty of airspeed after punching it. I was expecting a close corn rub when I punched it and dropped the nose to get out of the stall I was in but not for the corn to grab her. I was SHOCKED :jaw drop: when I saw the tail go straight up, nose down and BOOM!

So consider this a service from HorizonRcFlyers, we fly and learn the hard way so you don't have to!

Cost to repair will be a new airframe(if I were to replace the entire airframe), I have an extra :cool:, and then probably two motors. Hopefully everything else will be fine. I will be thoroughly testing out the RX, ESC's and Servos before putting them into live flight. Looking at the Deuces Wild you may wonder HOW could those motors get damaged that far back from the nose that hit first. The nose buried itself so far into the ground that the face of the Nacelles is what stopped the plane from going wing deep. The motors sit just behind the face of the Nacelles and were buried into the ground. Both are dented up, full or dirt and horribly misaligned. I think they are trash, but will take a look just in case they just look bad.

Wayne

[phantomphan]

And here I was thinking the Dueces was your IMAC machine.:rolleyes:
Seriously thou, sorry about the crash. Happens to the best of us ocassionally. I think to keep our heads from getting too big.
Lord knows Ive embarrassed myself a couple times this year already.::irked:::laughing:

[WJCJR1]

.
Lord knows Ive embarrassed myself a couple times this year already.::irked:::laughing:

I continued the embarassment yesterday evening and LVC'd the POGO into the ground from a stall on a full dead stick approach.

I wasn't doing anything crazy at all, was pushing pretty hard and hit LVC. Called out a landing came in and the POGO carries speed and with our runway only being a limited length there was no way I was landing. I aborted came about and and half way to my landing destination the battery quit for good and I was in trouble. I had a choice of trying to glide her in, the corn or the trees. I almost made the glide in by about 5 feet when I coudl not recover from a small headwind that stalled me out.

Damage is significant as she dropped nose square to the ground.

Talk about a CRAZY weekend of flying. Thoroughly embarassed and lost for words other than time to repair, get back at her and get air under the wings. Will post some pictures later,then the repair photos. Front of fuselage pushed in about 1/4" is definitely fixable all else looks good.

Wayne

PS. Trainer boxed a whole family yesterday they're onboard and looking for some good times at the airfield.

[phantomphan]

Wayne, do you ever use a timer while flying? Ive got a plane that has a high fun factor but very limited fuel. In my case it mandatory that I use a timer to keep from having dead sticks.
Just a thought.
James

[apprentice1]

Wayne, sorry about the crash. I sentence you to a winter of rebuilding the Deuces Wild.

[tkrahlin]

I continued the embarassment yesterday evening and LVC'd the POGO into the ground from a stall on a full dead stick approach...

WOW! The Weekend from Hell...

I wrecked my Stearman, E-Flite Sukhoi and the Grasshopper.

Noon Friday, Running Bear and I got in about an hour of flying. Other than the oppressive heat, it was uneventful. James got lots of time on the Mustang and Corsair - the kid can fly anything my hangar now.

We went back out Friday evening just before sunset when the temperature finally got back down to double digits. On my first takeoff with the Stearman she skidded and fishtailed and headed for the curb and some young trees. I had no choice but to try to horse her up into the air and bank away from the trees. When I did she rolled over onto her back and smashed into the blacktop. Motor box and cowl are completely torn away from the fuselage and all four wingtips are broken. So much damage that I just ordered another ARF.

Yesterday I was playing with moving the CG back on the Sukhoi (I usually have all my planes nose heavy). The breezes were light, but variable. Just as I was about to flare, the breeze shifted almost 180* and the Sukhoi just nosed over into the asphalt. I haven't opened it up yet, but the initial inspection shows the front of the motor box is broken.

The Grasshopper met a nearly similar fate in a similar accident when I nosed it into the blacktop and bent [at least] the prop adapter and maybe the motor shaft.

[WJCJR1]

Wayne, do you ever use a timer while flying? Ive got a plane that has a high fun factor but very limited fuel. In my case it mandatory that I use a timer to keep from having dead sticks.
Just a thought.
James

Yes I use the timer however I was pushing her pretty hard and should have deducted from the timer to prevent the POGO LVC doom. I am sure the POGO warped in and out of the time continuim as well she was scooting! Timer a MUST, obviously I need to set the timer for the shortest possible time in the case I am time warping again to not go LVC.

Wayne, sorry about the crash. I sentence you to a winter of rebuilding the Deuces Wild.

Can't wait that long, NO WAY. In order of repair/build;

Repair POGO fuselage.
Build/Review EXTRA 300 a REAL 3D plane.........
Rebuild Deuces Wild
I want to have all this done ASAP, Terry if you read this and want something to do give me a call. I have a flying buddy, Terry, who loves to build and maybe I can keep him busy :happy bounce:


WOW! The Weekend from Hell...

I wrecked my Stearman, E-Flite Sukhoi and the Grasshopper.


Sorry to hear of your unplanned wrecks as well. I guess we got it out our systems and now we'll be great the rest of the year. I can't wait to have them all going again. I really enjoying tearing up the sky. Down to Apprentice, T-28 and Super Cub.

Wayne

[rcdude07]

Growing up, we blamed the crashes on "pockets of bad air." ::tonguee:

It's so hot that I'm sure you hit some pockets of bad air, especially with all those crashes between the two of you guys.


But seriously, it sucks dudes. But as long as the crash wasn't like the EDF shattering while flying at Joe Nall this year, or the jet crash of 2007 at Joe Nall, it's not the worst crash in R/C history.


2010 EDF Shattering

http://higherplaneproductions.com/media/JoeNall10_D4T2_03ConfettiSmo-H264.mov



2007 Jet Crash

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QV90WM7jQs8

[flyingmp]

Wayne, Sorry to hear about the Pogo crash. Hope the rebuild goes well. During the rebuild you can get rid of that stock tail wheel and put on the Dubro unit. Works much better and you aren't always straightening it.

[tkrahlin]

...Sorry to hear of your unplanned wrecks as well. I guess we got it out our systems and now we'll be great the rest of the year. I can't wait to have them all going again. I really enjoying tearing up the sky. Down to Apprentice, T-28 and Super Cub.

Wayne

Funny, but the only build I ever complained about was the WACO from Pilot-1, but that has turned out to the most stable flyer. With her light wing loading and the AXI motor, she really flies scale and floats down for landings. After getting it to altitude yesterday, I even handed it off to Running Bear. Had him shot a few approaches, then told to just go ahead and set her down. We finished the day flyingthe WACO until the sun set.

[tkrahlin]

Yes I use the timer however I was pushing her pretty hard and should have deducted from the timer to prevent the POGO LVC doom...

I know we talked about the LiPo alarms here before and there were many opinions. I've been using them ever since and they are flawless. No matter how easy or hard you fly, they will always measure the voltage left.

My alarms always go off earlier than LVC (about 3.6 volts) and that leaves you plenty of time to come around and land. I've come to learn that hearing the alarm isn't the same 'panic time' as LVC.

[WJCJR1]

Wayne, Sorry to hear about the Pogo crash. Hope the rebuild goes well. During the rebuild you can get rid of that stock tail wheel and put on the Dubro unit. Works much better and you aren't always straightening it.

The repair of the POGO will be an easy one.


Pull out the fuselage back to it's original position
Refit all the little balsa pieces, puzzle like strategy
Cut new pieces, 30 minute Epoxy them in
Due to my Spinner being bad from factory and not having made it to the LHS to purchase an aluminum spinner I did not have the spinner or backing plate on the motor. That being so when the motor pushed back it did no damage to the cowl. Not a scratch on her anywhere! If the backing plate was on the cowl would have erupted.

So maybe an hour to hour 1/2 and she'll be ready for a final check and off to the blue yonder.

Wayne

[WJCJR1]

I have finally begun the build of the E-Flite Deuces Wild #2.

It is a rather windy afternoon with winds gusting into the 20's so again NO maiden of the E-Flite EXTRA 300, regardless how much I want to maiden and report back I am waiting.

The DW #2 is coming along well, I have the Fuselage near completion. Hopefully I can get in a half hour+ a night this week and be close or even done by this weekend. The wing assembly is not terrible, wires are a small PITA, Epoxying the 2 Nacelles down-right :thumbs down:

Maybe, just maybe, I can maiden the EXTRA 300 and DW#2 this upcoming weekend! That should make for a fun and rewarding day at the airfield!

Wayne

[yc2011]

I have finally begun the build of the E-Flite Deuces Wild #2.

It is a rather windy afternoon with winds gusting into the 20's so again NO maiden of the E-Flite EXTRA 300, regardless how much I want to maiden and report back I am waiting.

Wayne

You are a much more careful man than I Wayne! I took the Apprentice out today for some heavy wind flying. WHAT A BLAST! No harm done to anything and landings and take offs were very comfortable facing into the wind. I'm glad I took the plane out because real life experience is worth much more than windy conditions on the sim. The Apprentice flew like a beauty and I'm proud of her work today against the wind.

I hope you get your planes back together soon. I remember seeing the Dueces Wild in one peice ;) last fall! It was a beautfy! Good Luck!

[Marcus Lord]

Wayne, I feel your pain! It must be heartbreaking. Sorry to see such a great aircraft in pieces.

This clip is another heartbreaking end to a Deuces Wild:

http://youtu.be/yrSnyjqxnpw

[WJCJR1]

That is a bad end to that DW. I read in the comments section the issue was reversed ailerons which confused the pilot.

I have maidened a coupld new airplanes for people, most recently a HobbyZone SuperCub, that upon pre-flight I noticed a reversed servo. For any airplane, especially though a DW sized or larger airplane, it is irresponsible to miss such a HUGE detail of a reversed servo. A basic set-up mistake like that can be very dangerous.

Wayne

[brianfp_400]

Rebuild and refly ! Thats my motto !

Don't feel bad. I am rebuilding my brand new Pulse 60 after a maiden catastrophe where my CC ICE 75 ESC totally fried in flight and I lost ALL controls. She nosed in and broke the fuselage into 3 pieces, smashed the cowl, and bent the wing joiner tube. I salvaged the tail feathers and wings (w/minor patch work). Luckily I salvaged all the main electrical components too. Castle Creations also replaced my ESC free of cost with only speculation as to why the original failed. Currently waiting for another slow boat from China for HH to restock the fuselage, wing tube, and cowl.

[WingingIt74]

Nobody asked, but where Sponge Bob, Patrick Star and Plankton ok? I think my boys would go in shock if they weren't. :)

http://www.horizonrcflyers.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=3707&d=1265501383

That might have been the problem all along, letting those goof balls fly :roflmao:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_1klTlbciqXY/SmJQH9AYIDI/AAAAAAAAAR0/QMah_va2lwI/S692/spongebob-squarepants.jpg